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Author Topic: October 4th Board meeting update!  (Read 8916 times)
Spitfire
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« on: October 07, 2008, 01:53:41 PM »

Saturday's meeting went as follows:


A few of us got there a little after 9:35. As we approached the front gate, we noticed the Vector security officer (James) standing at the entrance. He informed us that we would not be allowed in with the cameras. Mike made the suggestion that he call regional; however, just at that moment, Maria Santoro also approached the front gate and demanded that James call Regional.

 

We then continued on in to the clubhouse where we found 6 of the seven board members sitting at the table with two attorneys, Patty Gleason, as well as Stan the maintenance man.  Bonnie did not attend.

 

As we walked in and began setting up our cameras, Ron Kluge (President) began to express his objection to us video taping the meeting. One of the new attorneys (Alan Price Young) also interjected on the issue. We informed them that regional were on their way. The other attorney suggested that while we wait for regional, that the board go into executive session. We were then asked to leave, and did just that.

 

As we waited outside, an officer from regional arrived. He approached us and asked if we had called. We told him that we did suggest to the security officer to call, but that it was one of the board members that insisted that he do call.

 

The officer entered the clubhouse as we waited outside. After a few minutes we noticed him walking out of the clubhouse with Ron Kluge.

We approached the officer who told us that this was a civil matter and that regional had absolutely nothing to do with it. We did have a legal question for him in which he did say that his sergeant could probably answer. He called him on the radio and we waited for his arrival.

 

As we waited, the regional officer present answered many questions we had. He was quite helpful and offered us some great advice.

 

About 15 minutes later, an unmarked car arrived, driven by the sergeant. He came up to us and answered our legal question. We were very satisfied with his reply.

 

After a little over two hours waiting outside, the executive meeting ended and one of the board members came out to advise us.

 

We entered the clubhouse and began setting up the cameras again. As we did this, Ron made an announcement that the board decided on a new rule concerning video taping. He had the secretary (the one that actually types out the minutes, not Maria) read out the new rule that basically states that all those video taping without board approval would be fined $250 dollars. Mike immediately objected to this clear violation of our rights as well as the fact that this violates the by-laws which clearly state that by-laws can only be changed by membership vote. Ron responded by stating that Mike could not object.

 

WE KEPT THE "CAN'T DENY-IT" CAMERAS ROLLING!!

...as it is our right to do so.

Ron asked the board members if they were all in favor of approving the new rule. The vote went as follows: Ron, Maria, Matt, and Dave were all in favor. Noreen was against and April Sustained (Not apposed or in favor).

 

The meeting continued; by all committee liaisons reporting on their respective committees.

 

I'll go straight to the highlights:

Matt stated that they were behind $40,000.00 dollars and that he understood that this had to do with the current economic situation we were in, but that the 10 day notices already went out.

 

Stan reported that he got an estimate to repair the pool of about $45,000.00 dollars and that it did not include another 10 to $15,000.00 to do the surrounding walk-way.

Ron responded "which will definitely be an assessment to all members" "that would be about 800 dollars a property owner". Stan (God bless his soul) responded by saying that he did not feel that was fair considering the recent tag sales as compared to the previous years.

 

Ron then stated that the $800 could be broken up into 5 years. Noreen expressed her concern on this and Ron basically said that if a state agency comes in, we just have to do it. Ron than tabled the discussion for a future meeting.

 

Maria Santoro then reported on Security. She began by stating directly to Patty Gleason that she would go forward to expedite the issue with the $10,000 grant we were supposed to get for the security cameras. (Gee...that sounds like one of the options in my Vector Security Poll) Hope she actually is successful, considering for one reason/excuse or another, management hasn't been able to acquire it.

 

She also stated that they have a report of a certain homeowner that harassed one of the Vector security officers strictly over the phone, with racial slurs as well as comments of a sexual nature while continuously calling to report about ATVs. She said that they believe the suspect (Inflictor) did this to divert Vector's attention from other matters in the community.

 

She then reported on a particular homeowner that had once complained to a Vector officer regarding garbage in front of another homeowner's house and that he was quite irate, but that Vector did in fact respond appropriately to his complaint, stating that Vector always says thank you for reporting your complaint. She commented on the fact that the homeowner that complained was satisfied by the end results.

 

Ron then asked her, "Was this member in good standing?" Patty replied, "No!"

 

During the course of the meeting, Noreen had asked Patty (NEPA Management) several questions regarding past follow-up action items. Most of her responses were, "I don't know!" It got to the point that Noreen had to address her directly by stating that if she asks her questions, could she try not to be so snotty, as she has heard of  quite a few others that have complained about the very same thing. Patty snapped back and Ron then intervened by suggesting that the matter be held for a later executive session.

 

The meeting ended a little after 2:20 pm, we left.

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ANNA MAE K MILLS
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« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2008, 02:54:57 PM »

Truth is Beauty,Beauty is Truth
Thats all we need to know
Thats all we ever need to know
          Keats
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Mike
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« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2008, 03:52:50 PM »

Hi Spitfire,
I feel I have to give our board a lesson on reading and Interpreting Bylaws. 

Facts:
  • Ron Kluge stated: “the board understands that the Bylaws specifically state for board approval only”
  • Webster Definition of Association: “an organization of persons having a common interest” We the people make up the Association.
  • The Bylaws are divided into Articles.
    Article I: Describes the Name and Purpose of the Association, Membership who and what makes up the Association (US), and Definitions.
    Article II: Describes the Associations (our) rights with respect to Meetings, Quorum, and Voting.
    Article III: Describes the Board of Directors rights and requirements with respect to numbers, power, and meetings.
    Article IV, V, VI, VII continue describing the rights and requirements of other components that make up our Association.  (Please read them)
  • Article II: Clearly states our (the Association) right to video record meetings. “The president shall preside over all meetings of the Association, and the Secretary shall keep the minutes of the meeting and record in a minute book all resolutions adopted at the meeting, as well as a record of all other transactions. Video or audio recordings of meetings may be made with the knowledge of all present. The recordings, if made, shall be part of the official record and shall be maintained and safeguarded in an appropriate manner as are other official records.”
  • Article III: Clearly states the Board also has the right to video record the meeting.  ““The president shall preside over all meetings of the Board of Directors’ and the Secretary shall keep a minute book of the Board of Director’ meetings, recording all resolutions adopted by the Board of Directors, and a record of all other transactions and proceedings occurring at the meeting.  Meetings may be audio or video recorded and these recordings shall be maintained as a permanent record for a minimum of three years.”

If you read these last two Bullets, you will not find Ron Kluge’s statement “the Bylaws specifically state for boards approval only” anywhere.   The difference between the Association requirements and the Boards, is we (the association) need to provide a copy of the video for the record, and the Board is required to maintain that video for three years. 

By fining the members who exercise their rights to videotape, they are in fact opening the community up to unnecessary litigation at (our) the associations expense.
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THE EXPERT
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« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2008, 06:08:32 PM »

Mike:

There is no public participation. The matter will be on the agenda and perhaps two month later they will enter an order.

*******************

   Who came up with the figure of an $800.00 assessment.  Note that there are no provisions in our deeds that would provide the Seller with the right to demand “Special Assessments.”
    In addition, if there were such a provision, (under PA law) it has to be proportionate or a pro-rated share.
   If you take the proposed $800.00 and multiply it by the 997 lots in the community; you get an amount over 780 thousand dollars!  That is a heck of a pool, Ron!
   In a previous newsletter a few years ago Ron referred to the association’s financials as the “Honey Pot!”  He made the claim (at the time) that it was flat!  I suppose that since a few years have gone by, Ron needs a new metaphor.  The “Pool is flat!”  Ok Ron, let’s start cutting some costs! After all we are in an economic depression, in case you have not heard.
   How about eliminating the over one hundred thousand dollars that Thomas Wilkins drains out of this community every year!  Do you think that it might fill the pool just a little, Ron?
   Instead of high price lawyers, do you think that you, or your vice-president might have the simple level of intelligence, that is required to represent our community at the District Magistrate level?
   Instead of running your mouth and insulting members in good standing.  Why don’t you use your vociferous skills before the District Magistrate for the benefit of this community?
   Some people might just get the idea that you are just a, “Coward with Power.”
   Don’t  you remember the days of Angelo Cretella, David Weinstein, and their infighting with Theodore Bomba?  The resignation letter by Allan Price Young?  You remember; you were there!  Ask Nancy Schmerber she was the secretary!
   You now bring in the same lawyer that wanted nothing to do with this community, when you and Weinstein were in charge back in 1995!
   Thirteen year ago this same attorney resigned as solicitor for this community, stating in a letter to then “acting president  Angelo Cretella”: (an individual who did not ever own property in this community.)
   “We wish to point out affirmatively that we have made many recommendations to the Association and issued legal opinions in support of those recommendations which either have not been acted upon or have been found unacceptable by this Association Board of Directors.   As we have cautioned your Board, there may be substantial adverse consequences to individual directors and to the Association for any board member's failing to meet the legal standards of due care and to comply with the requirements of loyalty and honesty as fiduciaries of the Association. These are very serious matters.”
   So what has change Mr. Young?   As an officer of the Court you have an obligation to the members of this Community to explain to them, exactly what has changed!
   You have openly stated that you represent the Board!  As an officer of the Court you have an obligation to inform your client that it derives it’s authority, having been assigned the rights of the Seller, by way of an agreement entered into with the original developer Sun Dance Stillwater Corporation, on February 12, 1981.
   Accordingly, your client stands in exactly the same shoes as Sun Dance!  You therefore, have an obligation to inform your client that there are no provisions for mandatory membership in an association of owners, or for the adoption of arbitrary rules, regulations or by-laws! ( Not otherwise provided for in the standard deed of conveyance.)  Your client is limited to the authority granted to the Grantor! Nothing less, and nothing more!
   Any advice to the contrary will only result in this community filing numerous complaints with the Pennsylvania Bar Association which will seek to have you disbarred for malpractice.
   Mr. Young, if you think that you can just return to this community and carry on the same sham that was being perpetrated on this community back in 1995, then you had better stick the key in your Hyndai, and take a trip back to the past.


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puchichis
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« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2008, 07:23:04 PM »

Dave

If that is all she said about me ( Maria ). Then, that is true, However, i would not say, " completly satisfied". I would say, " Satisfied with an asterisk*". Of incompetance and deriliction of duty addressed and corrected by the subordinate security guard. If i would have not complained. She may still be talking on her cell phone with her friends and not doing what we pay her to do. That is put in some work. As far as Patty Gleasons opinion of me being in good standing. She knows i pay my dues before it is due and i get a 10 percent discount on my yearly dues. If i am not in good standing because i am holding the security dues in escrow as a protest to Vector security past poor performance. If that is what she thinks of me, then, Patty and the board can BITE ME! I will pay the security dues when i got my monies worth. That my friend, is my motto. Give me my monies worth! Only then i will pay the security dues. Escrow is a good thing. I would advise the board and Ms. Gleason not to piss me off with hear say for threir personal gain. As far as the $800 to fix the pool. Ron, i'd like to have some of that rock your smoking. However, i don't do illegal drugs. I'd suggest some mental rehabilitation. Because 1/3 of a million dollars to fix up the pool. you must be smoking rock. How about a baseball diamond, a tennis court, paved roads all around the community, ( So my wife dosen't have to fall and severly twist her ankle on Hawthorne Terrace on 9/25/2008). Oh yeah, i will be sending the copayment bill to NEPA management and you will pay it. I will tell you now ron boy. *, 80 ,800. Forgedaboudit!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Last Edit: October 07, 2008, 07:36:45 PM by RNACOR12 » Logged
Spitfire
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« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2008, 08:36:11 PM »

Rnacor12,

I didn’t mention your name; however, everyone who visits this site clearly knew who Maria was talking about. You should have been there (I can actually take you there virtually via “the video tape”) she seemed so proud about her security company. Oh by the way, before I forget. Patty a.k.a NEPA Management also suggested that the board instill a fine for members who harass the board and/or management. They clearly don’t know the meaning of Harass. I’ll get into that later in this post.

Maria had also mentioned how productive the last security meeting was (Sept 20th). Vector was focused on training and professionalism.

Well here’s my story on Vector professionalism: Thus far I have three separate homeowners who have confirmed that one of the Vector security officers (Johnny) is spreading a rumor that I was the one that called 18 times to report ATVs and that I called the female African American security officer the “N” word, as well as other sexually explicit comments. I am waiting to meet with two other homeowners to re-affirm as well as agree to testify, that Johnny is in fact spreading this vicious, malicious rumor about me.

Hmmm? How is it that Maria clearly states on video that they didn’t know who it was, as the phone number was supposedly blocked, but Johnny states with conviction that he was absolutely sure it was me? I’ve never even met Johnny. I know him as the one security officer that everyone seems to like.

Anyone that really likes the guy…please tell him not to get himself involved in this SLCA issue.

I have to say that someone is about to lose their house a whole lot sooner than expected if this continues. This is clear slander and I have a whole lot of evidence.

I’m not making any direct accusations, but, YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE!!! I demand you stop feeding Johnny these lies. I refuse to be put into the same position as a prior homeowner who fought for his rights. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions of what a person will do when their rights have been violated, including having their sewer cut off. We should all picture ourselves in that situation and ask ourselves exactly how we would react to such torment.


Rnacor12, I ask that you please post the Vector information here so any complaints can be documented.

They say a mouse will bite his leg off if caught in a trap. Looks like someone may be beginning to chew at their knees.
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Mike
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« Reply #6 on: October 07, 2008, 11:27:20 PM »

Hi Spitfire,
I’m not surprised of you’re discontent with Vector, this has been going on for a long time.  Remember when a member noticed that the radar gun vector was using to fine our community for speeding, was out of calibration for over a year.  Not to mention the complaints about Vector officers hanging out with the kids at the basketball courts, talking with their girl friends, giving their girl friends rides in the patrol car.  And there’s rnacor12’s bad experience, yours, and I’m sure many other members who have not had the option to share their story.

Just the other night I got a call from a neighbor about another neighbors lights being on and seeing shadows moving around.  The house in question was only seasonal and should have been vacant.  I went to check out the house, saw lights on, and called security.  Security arrived, and together we checked out the premises.  We found an open window in the basement, and I recommended to the officer that regional should be called. 

The security officer asked me if he could borrow my cell phone because theirs does not make outbound calls.  Keep in mind, the officer was very friendly and professional, but he had to borrow my phone to call regional.  If they spot something in progress, what do they do?  Flag someone down, and ask to borrow a cell phone.  On the other side, this was a new officer who may not have been trained to know his phone can call 911.  Either way, it doesn’t add up to the professional security company Maria tries to project. 

« Last Edit: October 08, 2008, 01:36:26 AM by Mike » Logged
ANNA MAE K MILLS
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« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2008, 04:10:00 AM »

The issue is money!!! $184,000.00  app. security.
We simply are  not getting what we are paying for.
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Spitfire
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« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2008, 08:55:54 AM »

Annie, I totally agree...major issue here is the $184,000/year security.

The other part of it is board member feduciary duty to the "Entire" community. The complaints have circulated--covered in frosting--and put out as the most tastiest cup cakes we pay for.

RNACOR12, "Escrow"...what an interesting concept. The concern here though is that if the entire community were to jump on that bandwagon, this could cause a rippling affect.

For one--Vector would still expect their payment, as they do have a contract with the "Association" (...and I use the term loosly). Non-payment could be termed as breach of said contract, which could lead Vector to take action against this community. Any action against this community, in essense, comes out of our pockets.

Second--As long as a judge were to rule that security was in fact, obtained legally (per by-laws--Three bids, etc., etc., etc), we the association would be held responsible for remedy to breached contract.

Expert, I'll just share my own personal opinion. Based on the brief conversation I had with Attorney Young, I feel that he in fact, is on the up and up. My expectations may have been set too high at Saturday's meeting. I believe that; as the board's solicitor, he will once again pull out if he finds something that could possibly bring on any risk of liability to his firm, as well as his reputation (and not to mention, his bar status). Keep in mind...Saturday's "Executive Session" lasted over 2 hours and the major topics were current litigations. In other words, we've got a lot of legal issues going on.
I strongly believe they've brought in the best in the business. (Capt. Alan P. Young) http://www.eastpennlaw.com/jsp2730373.jsp

Why he came back after what went on in the 90's will forever remain a mystery, as we still have a few of the same in power back then, today.

I'd love to know why attorney Ralston is no longer the board's attorney. Hmmmm?


Spitfire
« Last Edit: October 08, 2008, 12:23:21 PM by Spitfire » Logged
THE EXPERT
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« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2008, 02:02:23 PM »

Spitfire:

What in this “brief conversation” convinced you that Attorney Young is on the up and up?

Did he explain to you, why he came back?

Or did he, like any other slick operator, claimed that he does not remember?

Keep in mind that attorneys are duty bound to defend criminals, mass murderers, as well as others who have a right to an attorney. They collect their money, and then whisper to their client as he is being strapped to the electric chair, “I’m sorry, but you lost!”

The past will not be admitted, nor will it be discussed.  I believe that they call it “attorney-client privilege.”

That is why he is able to come back, and not worry about community scrutiny.
 
No doubt that they brought in the best in the business!

He is the best in the business at defending HOA’s Board of Directors, against their main enemy, the property owner!

Young, was instrumental in implementing the Uniform Communities Act.  The main function which is to convert the many communities, and their complicated documents, into one uniform doctrine by which HOA’s could stick it to the property owners.

Ask yourselves, what protection does the Act provide to me as homeowners or lot owners?

I will tell you what it provides to residents of Stillwater Lakes.  It provides that our deeds (Community Documents) supersede the Act!

So why shouldn’t this community start demanding from the ace who brought you the Act, to start implementing the provisions of that Act?

We do so, by demanding that Mr. Young, and the Board recognize that the Board’s authority is limited to that of the original Seller Developer Sun Dance Stillwater, Corp.

As determined by a Federal Court judge, it does not include adopting or relying on arbitrary rules, regulations, or by-laws, which were never included in our deed of conveyance.   Those very rules, regulations and by-laws are exactly what the Board manipulates in order to make it impossible for the average owner to have anything say.

The only response that we can all expect from Mr. Young, and a majority of the Board is, “You Are Out of Order!”

So, I ask you my friend, who or what is out of order?

   Stillwater Lakes Community response to the Board, and attorney Young should be:

MY DEED, RULES IN DEED!

To answer your question:

   Ralston is no longer our attorney, because this Board, like all other bankrupt entities needs to point the finger at the scapegoat.  The guilty parties simply fade into the background.

What does freedom mean? Watch our nation's symbol fly.

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfevfJNDuIg&eurl=http://www.eagles.org/aef
   
« Last Edit: October 08, 2008, 02:13:46 PM by THE EXPERT » Logged
Spitfire
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« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2008, 02:56:14 PM »

Expert,

When I said, "...Up and Up" I meant that he would defend his client to the very end. I guess my false expectations were that when I asked him if he was the same attorney that sent the letter to the board, pulling out, back in the early 90's that he would just open up a can of ugly. Little did I think at that moment that he had an obligation to defend them to the very end, even if he knew beyond the shadow of a doubt all that was wrong with this picture. His actual response was something to the effect of, "even convicted criminals change--Sometimes we just have to leave things in the past".

He also said the board had to work on rebuilding the community's trust.
(I never knew they were issued a permit to construct trust the first time around)

We did question him about the first rights of refusal and he did say that he could not discuss that with us for the moment.

As far as our "Nation's symbol"...great video.

I guess our community's symbol would be a flock of birds consisting of; A Vulture, a penguin, a turkey, a chicken and a do-do bird. ...and let's not forget the two young chicks-too young to tell what species of bird.

We should also change our name from "Stillwater Lakes" to "LooseRock Roads".

Thanks to the board member that suggested the rock walkways--Great idea!  Angry

Spitfire
« Last Edit: October 08, 2008, 03:03:19 PM by Spitfire » Logged
THE EXPERT
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« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2008, 08:29:32 PM »

On the right of first refusal.

Where did the association get this right?

If it comes from your Sun Dance deed, then the association had no right to enforce it, or sell it, since the official spokesman for the Association Mr. Curtis Moore, announced publically that Sun Dance deeds had “ran out!”  So if those deeds ran out, what exactly did the association sell to Thomas Wilkins?   

But just in case that Curtis made a boo-boo, here is the exact wording as per your deed of conveyance:

22.  That at any time in the future the SELLER, its successors or assigns, shall have the right to purchase said premisses if the PURCHASER, desires to sell same.  If at any time, the PURCHASERS, their heirs, executors or administrators receive a bonafide offer for the premises and the PURCHASERS, their heirs, executors or administrators decide to accept such offer, they shall first give written notice to the SELLER and SELLER shall have the right within thirty (30) days from the receipt of such written notice to purchase said premises at the price offered the PURCHASER by such party.

In other words, if I make an offer to Purchase your dwelling, let’s say for $300,000.00
You have to notify Mr. Wilkins to match the offer.  Once notified by Certified Mail, Mr. Wilkins has a legal obligation to reply immediately.

If he expresses an interest in Purchasing your dwelling, Mr. Wilkins has thirty days to come up with the dough. You have every right to demand that he pay Cash!

If Mr. Wilkins does not respond within a reasonable 10 day notice, then you have the right to sell you dwelling to whoever you please.

So, I would like to know, who came up with this nonsense that you have to pay anyone anything, to sell your property?

The covenant makes no provisions for the payment of anything to anyone.  HELLO!

So how did this covenant become a cash cow, for the new face of Pocono Medical Center?

I hope that this does not come as a shock to Tom. But then again, he can just take another Nitro.

« Last Edit: October 08, 2008, 08:32:16 PM by THE EXPERT » Logged
puchichis
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« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2008, 08:47:59 PM »

To all members:

To file a complaint with Vector Security, please write, call and fax to:

Vector Corporate Services Office (Pittsburgh)
3400 McKnight East Drive
Pittsburgh, PA 15237
(888)-VECTOR1
(412) 364-2600
(412) 364-2712 - Fax

And/ Or

Vector regional office
Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania
23 Casey Avenue
Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania 18702-7401
(800) 222-6565
(570) 824-4605
(570) 829-8189

As stated before, i was not completly satisfied with the results vector had given me. Partly because, i took the advice by the Expert ( thanks pal ) to call the Monroe county waste management authority to enforce the littering law on my absent neighbors. Vector and NEPA management had nothing to do with the outcome and /or final results of my complaint. I was only glad a vector security representative had contacted me about the guard in question and offered an apology to me and an assurance to me that she would be dealt with. I did all of the leg and phone work. Vector and NEPA management did nothing to end the littering. It was the work on my end that made the difference. Thats why i say, give me my monies worth! I should have been paid to do a job that the Vector guard in question should have done. However, she refused to do anything and she handed me a NEPA management complaint form ( Way to go vector ). Then to add insult to injury, Patty Gleason called me one week later and asked me, " What can i do for you'? Duh! I already took care of the problem ( Way to go NEPA management ). I guess one hand does washes the other. The end result is, the hands are still dirty. What we need to give these two dirty hand is PUMICE POWER. 
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Mike
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« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2008, 09:38:33 PM »

Expert,
Legally the board can not sell a deeded right without 100% of the planned community deed holders voting to do so.  However, I'm not going to complain because now that they sold it, we no longer have to pay a First Right of Refusal Fee because the Seller no longer owns it.  Remember the First Right of Refusal is an agreement between the seller and a buyer, Wilkins is neither so we are all better off.

I would urge everyone selling a house or lot in our community to ask Wilkins (the new face of Pocono Medical Center) to show the First Right of Refusal contract he has with you. 

Deceit, Fraud & Deception runs rapid in our community.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2008, 11:27:27 PM by Mike » Logged
Spitfire
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« Reply #14 on: October 09, 2008, 07:37:20 AM »

Expert, Mike,

Let's not forget that the First Rights of Refusal (FRR) was a money maker for the association. If done properly, these funds could have been used for extra stuff like; better night lighting throughout the community, better amenities for the children, more productive activities for our teenagers, and maybe even a little "dues" rebate for all home owners at the end of the year.

Face it, if you sell your house, its the buyer that pays the FRR fee. They suck it up as nothing more than additional "Closing Cost".


What could have been well needed and used funds for this community is now "Peanuts" for a someone else. Thank you board, keep up the good work!!!  Angry

Spitfire
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